The UK's Gig Economy

[BacktoDemocracy]

I thought I would post this for information for those wondering about whether coming back to the UK is the right thing for careers and futures for them and their children

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/jun/28/gig-economy-in-britain-doubles-accounting-for-47-million-workers

If people want to dispute it please direct your disputes to the BOE and the Govt Statistics dept and the University concerned with the study.

[VERYSTORMY]

You do though know, that this problem is global, certainly among first world countries? Including Australia, which has one of the highest rates in the world https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-04-25/australia-sees-increase-in-casual-workers-ai-job-threats/11043772

There is a long standing joke in Oz, which has more than a bit of truth. "What's the fastest way to speak to an accountant? Call an Uber"

This is a global problem and affecting even so called more left economies such as many in mainland Europe. 

[Marisawright]

I agree with VeryStormy, the same problem exists in Australia.    

[BacktoDemocracy]

11 hours ago, Marisawright said:

I agree with VeryStormy, the same problem exists in Australia.    

Seemingly so

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-04-25/australia-sees-increase-in-casual-workers-ai-job-threats/11043772

I suppose one of the things about it in the UK is the size and its identifiable as an integral part of the economy here with the likes of Amazon, uber, deliveroo and call centres and a much larger web based economy involving very large numbers in order despatch and transport and almost complete absence of trade unions and employment legislation.

There is also how wage increases have been kept down now for 10 years with salaries not even keeping up with inflation 

Edited June 29, 2019 by BacktoDemocracy

[BacktoDemocracy]

20 hours ago, VERYSTORMY said:

You do though know, that this problem is global, certainly among first world countries? Including Australia, which has one of the highest rates in the world https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-04-25/australia-sees-increase-in-casual-workers-ai-job-threats/11043772

There is a long standing joke in Oz, which has more than a bit of truth. "What's the fastest way to speak to an accountant? Call an Uber"

This is a global problem and affecting even so called more left economies such as many in mainland Europe. 

Some attempts by the EU to legislate to control abuses

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-47947220        EU law fixes minimum rights for 'gig economy' workers

https://fullfact.org/law/zero-hours-contracts-uk-europe/       The prevalence of the gig economy across the EU

[VERYSTORMY]

Yep, but not unsurprisingly, the main offenders have found ways around it. For example, it is often regarded as simple self employment, which is easy to do. 

Hence, all the main offenders are present in places like Paris such as Uber and the food delivery companies like deliveroo. The conditions of the workers is still as crap. 

It suits politicians regardless of political side. They all want to show lower unemployment, regardless of what that actually means. So, they are all happy to make some bold statements against the abuses of the gig economy, but while not really doing very much on the ground. Because, if they came out and said we will no longer count them as employed as these jobs are what I like to call "none "jobs", the unemployment rate would be significantly increased and it becomes hard politically, so far better to have millions of self employed and claim that they are encouraging entrepreneurs than actually come out and deal with the hard reality. 

Unless politiicans in every country, across every political persuasion decide to start to deal with it, it will just get worse. Personally, I would ban the main offenders. 

[Marisawright]

On 29/06/2019 at 20:39, BacktoDemocracy said:

I suppose one of the things about it in the UK is the size and its identifiable as an integral part of the economy here with the likes of Amazon, uber, deliveroo and call centres and a much larger web based economy involving very large numbers in order despatch and transport and almost complete absence of trade unions and employment legislation.

There is also how wage increases have been kept down now for 10 years with salaries not even keeping up with inflation 

You could be talking about Australia there too.   The unions have very little power now and the re-elected government is already talking about  legislation to "create flexibility in the workforce"....they've already got rid of penalty rates.

There has been a lot of press recently about how wages have stagnated in Australia over recent years, with no sign of it changing. 

Edited July 2, 2019 by Marisawright

[Marisawright]

One thing that surprises me - the number of younger people who are in the gig economy BY CHOICE, not because they can't get another job.

Being a dancer, I meet a lot of people in the Arts.  Talk to anyone over 40, and they'll talk about the difficulties of being a dancer/musician/artist in their youth..   Only the lucky/very talented few were able to get a scholarship or a full-time gig of some sort in their late teens/early twenties, and went on to a full-time career.  If you didn't manage that, then your only option was to train in something else and get a "proper job". We had to resign ourselves to the fact that our art would be a hobby or a part-time pursuit. 

When I talk to the under-40's, I'm struck by how many of them have never had a "proper job".  The idea of working in a "boring office" is anathema to them, and the very idea of some employer telling them what to do - unthinkable!   "I'm an artist!"  Unlike my generation, they've been able to scrape a living from their Uber driving,  Airtasker, etc etc., which has allowed them to persevere with their artistic ambitions long after our generation would've been forced to give up.

I would've assumed "artists' were a fairly small part of the population - but I'm astonished how many there are.  Singers especially - it sometimes seems that anyone who can hold a tune, thinks they have a shot at finding fame on Youtube. The sad fact is that many of them have little talent, which explains why they're still driving an Uber at 35 and still hoping for their "breakthrough".  

Edited July 2, 2019 by Marisawright

[BacktoDemocracy]

7 hours ago, Marisawright said:

You could be talking about Australia there too.   The unions have very little power now and the re-elected government is already talking about  legislation to "create flexibility in the workforce"....they've already got rid of penalty rates.

There has been a lot of press recently about how wages have stagnated in Australia over recent years, with no sign of it changing. 

Hadn't realised that the Libs were taking pages out of the Tories Austerity, neo lib handbook, inevitable really, what with Lynton Crosby crossover between the Tories and Libs.

 

[Marisawright]

7 minutes ago, BacktoDemocracy said:

Hadn't realised that the Libs were taking pages out of the Tories Austerity, neo lib handbook, inevitable really, what with Lynton Crosby crossover between the Tories and Libs.

 

Indeed they are.  You may be aware of Tony Abbott and his "Fair Work" legislation (talk about Orwellian) - ScoMo can't wait to bring it back, IMO.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-16/wages-growth-stagnation,-industrial-laws-effect-workers-business/11118924

Edited July 2, 2019 by Marisawright

[BacktoDemocracy]

11 hours ago, Marisawright said:

One thing that surprises me - the number of younger people who are in the gig economy BY CHOICE, not because they can't get another job.

Being a dancer, I meet a lot of people in the Arts.  Talk to anyone over 40, and they'll talk about the difficulties of being a dancer/musician/artist in their youth..   Only the lucky/very talented few were able to get a scholarship or a full-time gig of some sort in their late teens/early twenties, and went on to a full-time career.  If you didn't manage that, then your only option was to train in something else and get a "proper job". We had to resign ourselves to the fact that our art would be a hobby or a part-time pursuit. 

When I talk to the under-40's, I'm struck by how many of them have never had a "proper job".  The idea of working in a "boring office" is anathema to them, and the very idea of some employer telling them what to do - unthinkable!   "I'm an artist!"  Unlike my generation, they've been able to scrape a living from their Uber driving,  Airtasker, etc etc., which has allowed them to persevere with their artistic ambitions long after our generation would've been forced to give up.

I would've assumed "artists' were a fairly small part of the population - but I'm astonished how many there are.  Singers especially - it sometimes seems that anyone who can hold a tune, thinks they have a shot at finding fame on Youtube. The sad fact is that many of them have little talent, which explains why they're still driving an Uber at 35 and still hoping for their "breakthrough".  

 

I think its a combination of things, speaking to a friend with a 21 year old who is leaving with a degree in Biology and is confronted by a lack of job options, other than being a gofer in a lab, all the interesting jobs are taken by Phd's so a degree now only gets you the jobs that only 25 years ago were done by bright kids on day release, he wants to do a conversion course to get into law but his father is trying to divert him away from that as the Law is is over subscribed with even fewer opportunities unless you're brilliant or are already on the inside track because of 'connections'.

Faced with those dilemmas and after being egged on constantly that a degree opens up a golden world only to be confronted with the reality that the jobs they can get are the equivalent to nailing bits of wood together in slightly complex shapes and that might only last for 6 or 7 years and lead nowhere its little wonder that they choose to just opt out and also apparently have some control over their lives.

The bottom line is that we are seeing Capitalism consume itself in its greed as it reaches its nadir, elitism, inequality and exploitation without any rewards for the exploited is now creating a completely disaffected and disengaged generation as they reject Capitalism because they feel the affects of it on them, job and career instability, accommodation insecurity, wage insecurity, even when they get a "proper" job it can be whisked away as even giant companies collapse. Capitalism's  insatiable greed is now consuming itself as it becomes apparent to this generation that there is no secure niche for them no matter how hard they work, deliveroo, Amazon order picking, uber driving or go for the big money, drug dealing and migrant smuggling, there' not much to choose really, is there? 

Politicians mouthing stupidities about training for 2or 3 careers over a lifetime when people can't even get fulfilling job with a degree in their 20's, it's a silent revolt by a generation that has been fed a lie but has not quite worked out what the lie is yet, nor quite who it is that has lied to them because everyone has been complicit in the lie.

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