Aged parent in queue for 804 visa

[feltron_cq]

Hoping someone might be able to advise me please.

My Dad has been in the queue for 804 visa for about 5 years now, so still a long time to go. He is in pretty good health, but is now 90. He has been living with us in Queensland and because he is from UK, he is entitled to a reciprocal Medicare card, which has been great.  

As he gets older, we are starting to think it might not be too long before he needs residential care, but we don't think this is possible. I don't want to enquire too far with Centrelink in case they catch wind of the fact that he is getting older and his health might be deteriorating, and decree that he no longer meets the good health requirements for the 804 visa queue. We have heard of people in a similar situation being sent back to UK, or at the very least threatened with being sent back. He has no family over there now and has become accustomed to living here.

I'm just wondering if there is anything we can do to get him full Medicare coverage? It seems to me that he meets the requirements of the Aged dependent relative 838 visa and this might be worth exploring, but I have no idea what sort of waiting time there might be for that visa. He is not wealthy enough to pay for the 864 Contributory Aged Parent Visa.

Would really value any thoughts or comments please.

[Quoll]

If he needs residential care then you are going to have to pay for it, it's not a Medicare thing and it's unlikely that he will get full medicare coverage until he  becomes PR - probably wont make that much difference, he's entitled to necessary medical care now.  It looks like the 838 visa has a medical requirement as well - no condition that is likely to be costly or potentially take away from others in the community.  If he cant afford the CPV he's going to struggle to pay residential care fees.  You'd best talk to an agent about your strategy!

[feltron_cq]

1 minute ago, Quoll said:

If he needs residential care then you are going to have to pay for it, it's not a Medicare thing and it's unlikely that he will get full medicare coverage until he  becomes PR - probably wont make that much difference, he's entitled to necessary medical care now.  It looks like the 838 visa has a medical requirement as well - no condition that is likely to be costly or potentially take away from others in the community.  If he cant afford the CPV he's going to struggle to pay residential care fees.  You'd best talk to an agent about your strategy!

Understand we would have to pay for care, but I thought I understood that there is a subsidised daily rate that he would only be entitled to if he has a full Medicare card. I have been trying to find the costs of care homes if we had to pay the full unsubsidised fees, but this information does not seem readily available.

[Tulip1]

4 hours ago, feltron_cq said:

Understand we would have to pay for care, but I thought I understood that there is a subsidised daily rate that he would only be entitled to if he has a full Medicare card. I have been trying to find the costs of care homes if we had to pay the full unsubsidised fees, but this information does not seem readily available.

The cost of care homes must be available.  You just ask them don’t you. My mum went into one here in the UK six months ago and of the ones I contacted,  they all told me the weekly rate. 
This may be nothing to do with what you mean but it sounds like it does. In the UK you can get a small subsidy if the person needs nursing and that is paid for by the NHS. Maybe that’s the Medicare subsidised daily rate you mean. If so it is very hard to meet the requirements. You must need professional nursing care and that doesn’t mean you need help with taking your pills. My mum has advanced dementia, doesn’t even know who I am most of the time. She also has advanced COPD and is registered partially blind as she has macular degeneration.  She’s not entitled to the nursing element as she doesn’t need consistent nursing. She’s been deemed by social services as needing 24 hour care but that can be done by the carers in the care home and doesn’t require a nurse. Therefore, someone needs to be very bad to get that subsidy.  Even if she ever becomes eligible, it’s less than quarter of the weekly cost so the fees are still high.  The persons primary care needs to medical not social. So whilst someone such as my mum cannot live on her own, even with carers going many times a day, her primary need is still considered social as she just needs looking after. She cannot even dress herself or shower herself but her needs aren’t medical. The bottom line is apart from a tiny exception of extremely ill people, you have to pay the fees. 

[Quoll]

5 hours ago, feltron_cq said:

Understand we would have to pay for care, but I thought I understood that there is a subsidised daily rate that he would only be entitled to if he has a full Medicare card. I have been trying to find the costs of care homes if we had to pay the full unsubsidised fees, but this information does not seem readily available.

Bridging visa holders for the parent visas cannot get a full medicare card - it's very clear about that on the medicare website.

There is means testing for some portion of the care home fees as I read it - but that would only apply to citizens and permanent residents as temporary residents arent entitled to any government benefits at all and any subsidy would be a benefit.

Call the care homes and ask them, they'll know how much they are going to charge you.

[Marisawright]

16 hours ago, feltron_cq said:

Understand we would have to pay for care, but I thought I understood that there is a subsidised daily rate that he would only be entitled to if he has a full Medicare card. I have been trying to find the costs of care homes if we had to pay the full unsubsidised fees, but this information does not seem readily available.

Where did you find the information about this special daily rate that's linked to Medicare?  I can't find any trace of it, anywhere. 

Surprisingly, I can't find any mention on the government website that says Aged Care is only available to citizens and permanent visa holders.  The subsidies are paid to the care home, not to the individual, and fees are charged based on a number of criteria.  There is a financial hardship process:

https://www.myagedcare.gov.au/financial-hardship-assistance

There is a subsidised daily rate that's available to people who are receiving Centrelink benefits (which your parent isn't eligible for).  Could that be it?

[feltron_cq]

13 minutes ago, Marisawright said:

Where did you find the information about this special daily rate that's linked to Medicare?  I can't find any trace of it, anywhere. 

Surprisingly, I can't find any mention on the government website that says Aged Care is only available to citizens and permanent visa holders.  The subsidies are paid to the care home, not to the individual, and fees are charged based on a number of criteria.  There is a financial hardship process:

https://www.myagedcare.gov.au/financial-hardship-assistance

There is a subsidised daily rate that's available to people who are receiving Centrelink benefits (which your parent isn't eligible for).  Could that be it?

My understanding is that Aged Care in Australia costs a flat rate, regardless of location and the level of care required. There are provisions for care to be paid for in various ways. One of which is to deposit a lump sum into a pot. Knowing that the actual costs of aged care cannot really be as low as this daily charge, I am assuming that this is a subsidised rate. I assume that this would only be available via the Government aged care program, and I do not believe this would be available to a non resident. Of course there are a lot of assumptions in this. I was hoping that someone might be able to give me some facts, so I can start planning.

The problem I have faced is that all of the care homes are so used to their residents paying the standard daily rate that they are actually not set up for a case outside of this.

Plus my concerns that if my parent requires aged care then he may be deemed to no longer meet the good health requirements of the Aged Parent 804 visa. I don't have time just now to search, but I know I have read of cases on Pomsinoz, where an aged parent was threatened with being sent back to UK in a similar situation. I am thinking that this is less likely in the current Global Pandemic, but it would be nice to hear if anyone has any recent experience.

[feltron_cq]

12 hours ago, Tulip1 said:

The cost of care homes must be available.  You just ask them don’t you. My mum went into one here in the UK six months ago and of the ones I contacted,  they all told me the weekly rate. 
This may be nothing to do with what you mean but it sounds like it does. In the UK you can get a small subsidy if the person needs nursing and that is paid for by the NHS. Maybe that’s the Medicare subsidised daily rate you mean. If so it is very hard to meet the requirements. You must need professional nursing care and that doesn’t mean you need help with taking your pills. My mum has advanced dementia, doesn’t even know who I am most of the time. She also has advanced COPD and is registered partially blind as she has macular degeneration.  She’s not entitled to the nursing element as she doesn’t need consistent nursing. She’s been deemed by social services as needing 24 hour care but that can be done by the carers in the care home and doesn’t require a nurse. Therefore, someone needs to be very bad to get that subsidy.  Even if she ever becomes eligible, it’s less than quarter of the weekly cost so the fees are still high.  The persons primary care needs to medical not social. So whilst someone such as my mum cannot live on her own, even with carers going many times a day, her primary need is still considered social as she just needs looking after. She cannot even dress herself or shower herself but her needs aren’t medical. The bottom line is apart from a tiny exception of extremely ill people, you have to pay the fees. 

The aged care programme in Australia is very different to the one in UK, as I mentioned in another reply. My mother was also in aged care in UK and her care was means tested and partially paid for by the local council. Different homes had different rates and it varied according to the level of care required. It's more constant and centralised in Australia.